Instagram for Building Thought Leadership with Anjuli Gopalakrishna

[00:00:00] Surbhi Dedhia: Hey Anjuli, welcome to the making of a thought leader podcast. It's absolutely my pleasure to have you on board today. 

[00:00:07] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Thank you. Thank you so much. The pleasure is totally mine. I'm super excited and looking forward to our conversation 

[00:00:15] Surbhi Dedhia: Anjuli ever since we got to know each other and have exchange notes, and we talk about the business stuff, you will often have the statements saying that COVID has been kind to you and I always get intrigued because you know, it, it, it is like a counter narrative there's so I'm going to use this opportunity to ask you that. Why do you say so? 

[00:00:37] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Like I would say COVID has been kind to me in the sense that a lot of companies, a lot of people were you know sitting at home. Working from home, everything was happening from home. And there were a lot of people who in this time invested in learning. And even for me in Singapore here, the government itself supported a lot of people through a lot of these online learning programs and online became just a way of life during COVID.

[00:01:08] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So that helped me and my business, because I'm all about doing things online and teaching things online. So we completely pivoted and I've been running these online courses, training people about using digital marketing skills effectively, and it's all happening online. So of course, COVID was good for Zoom but was also good for people like me in that sense. 

[00:01:33] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. That's, that's a really interesting perspective. And on that, I want you to introduce yourself to the audience, you and me know each other with let's take a moment and have you introduce yourself to the audience. 

[00:01:46] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yep. So I am Anjuli and I'm the founder of A G Tech Pte. limited. It's a company which I founded in 2019 with the sole purpose and passion, you know, to, to help companies leverage the power of digital media and digital marketing and online technologies to, to, you know, do whatever it is that they want to achieve better. And we've been at it. I help small businesses and small companies and enterprises to leverage digital.

[00:02:17] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: I also train and I teach at a lot of these future skill programs. I've also been working with fortune 500 MNCs where the mandate is let's train our global marketing workforce so that we can get the work done better by their agencies. So digital marketing skills are here to stay all the marketers, the business owners, the CEOs, everybody needs to be in the know there is no choice any longer, not to know digital marketing skills.

[00:02:45] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So, so that's where I'm at. That's where I add value in my own way, I keep learning. And this is something that you have. Learning yourself and then imparting. So it's because every day there is some change. The technology is evolving at such a fast pace that you yourself are in the, you know, in the learning phase and then applying it and learning and apply and teach it.

[00:03:07] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So, so that keeps me on my toes. I just love being in the space. Yes. 

[00:03:12] Surbhi Dedhia: And you said that digital marketing is here to stay and I feel even the same goes for building one's thought leadership. On the show we talk about building thought leadership. I want to encourage entrepreneurs, business leaders to come out and talk about their experiences and.

[00:03:30] Surbhi Dedhia: One of the integral parts about doing so is using this digital marketing opportunity. So let's, let's talk a little bit more about your focus area, especially when you say digital marketing, it's like a huge landscape. And just for, just for this episode, and for the essence of, you know, what you do, where you impact the most is from what I understand is Instagram.

[00:03:58] Surbhi Dedhia: So today's episode let's dedicate to Instagram, and obviously if you want to add anything more. More than welcome. 

[00:04:05] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So you're very right in say that you know, branding and social media platform and thought leadership, they go very well together because you establish your thought leadership by spreading or sharing your ideas in social media and channels could be any, right.

[00:04:20] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So there are multiple channels available for you to do that. And, and why I started focusing on Instagram is that it's a very interesting story. I was I formed a social media group for entrepreneurs and I wanted to learn, I wanted it to be a safe sharing space for people to come together and just share their story of what's happening.

[00:04:42] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: What are you curious about? What are your challenges and stuff like that, and what happened is that every time, you know, the topic was around Instagram. I got the maximum engagement in the group. So there were a lot of entrepreneurs who were interested in knowing that, how do you crack it on this platform?

[00:04:58] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: How do you know, how do you make it, make this platform work for your business? And I realized that, okay, this is something there is a very high interest around this topic. And so I dived really deep on this subject matter. And, and I actually took five or six entrepreneurs on board, and I said, okay, I'll teach you every week. Every weekend, we will go on an online class you don't have to pay me for this. It's a free thing. Just come on board. And I will teach you all the tips that I have learned on how you can really use Instagram effectively for your business. And they came on board and 13 weekends. We stayed together. Wow.

[00:05:35] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Every weekend. Yeah. Which, which means that I was adding value, because that was a way for me to validate whether it, is it really something that people will find useful. And is it true that, you know, they are, they asking questions to me? I came to know, okay, this is what is the real, you know, the real ask or when somebody wants to learn Instagram, this is what they want to know.

[00:05:58] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: This is what they want to learn. So it gave me an opposite to instantly learn as I was teaching, what is it that people really would benefit from if I had to create a course? And so I kept refining as I was building with those entrepreneurs and the result was this deep dive Instagram course which, which I would like to share.

[00:06:19] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. That would be fantastic. And you know, I, as you were sharing this amazing story of yours, it reminded me of the fact that you learn the best when you teach others, when you constantly share. So you know what you learn and you apply immediately and share with others. So fantastic thing of paying it forward as you went along on your journey. Such a brilliant story. You know, Instagram as a social media platform.

[00:06:45] Surbhi Dedhia: You said entrepreneurs who came to you asking for it. So in, in the typical business situation, right, like B2B people think only LinkedIn is their go to platform. It's not Instagram. What is your take on that? 

[00:07:01] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: I believe that there is no B2B, there is no B2C, there is only H2H. Right. And what I mean by H2H is human to human, right?

[00:07:11] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Whether they're on any platform, ultimately people who are doing business with you are human beings and who, you know, you are going to buy or sell you are human beings, right? So I can be sure to get away from these kinds of definitions of B2B B2C, and really start thinking in terms of human to human and wherever people are.

[00:07:30] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You want to make an impact. You want to make a difference. You want to influence them. You want them to you know, change their behavior based on what you are putting out there in the world. So I really believe, I mean, even LinkedIn is on Instagram. Can you believe that? Right. LinkedIn, LinkedIn is one of the really fantastic examples of how to use Instagram.

[00:07:51] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Well, for a B2B context, if we had to use that lingo, you know, wow, it's a fantasy. You should check out how LinkedIn itself is using Instagram so effectively for them. Yeah, 

[00:08:03] Surbhi Dedhia: I'm, I'm really a late adopter of Instagram. I, I use it. I mean, I'm on it and I use it really to you know, find out the restaurant reviews or, you know, something fantastic happening around me, but not really use it to share my thought leadership or, you know, post photos or anything else.

[00:08:22] Surbhi Dedhia: So, yeah, I think you piquedmy interest there by saying that even LinkedIn is on. So you were saying that big brands are on Instagram and they are leveraging it.

[00:08:32] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah, totally, totally leveraging. And some of the good examples that come to mind who are really doing it well in the B2B space, of course one is LinkedIn, but you check out IBM, like who would think that IBM would use Instagram so effectively.

[00:08:46] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: That was a great job. Check them out. Zen desk is using it very well. MailChimp is another company which comes to mind, which is mix of fantastic. And you see, there are Instagram has particularly the young population, right? Like more than I think today, the platform, most of 1 billion people on its platform and the demography is typically younger.

[00:09:11] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And today, today we are sitting in a world where majority of the workforce belongs to that younger you know demographic. And so if you want to impact, if you want to influence that's the platform, other points from a B2B perspective, I remember meeting a business owner who came to me and did the typical mindset.

[00:09:34] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Like you said, Instagram, not for me, that kind of thing. He keeps searching and they are improved. These motion graphics. They make these you know, the special effects that you see in these films, like superhero movies and all their company is into that. Their, their customers, their typical target customer would be a Pixar or all of these big brands, visual animation offices.

[00:09:59] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Like my customer is not there. And why do I need some? Then the, the owner of the company himself came up with a very interesting take. He says, you know, the, one of the biggest pain points that I suffer from in my company is the churn. That people are not staying for, for long enough in the company, quick churn.

[00:10:18] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And so I want to establish the image of my company is that place where it's the great place to work. I want to, I want to showcase my company as the best place to work. And so that I can stop that churn from happening. People should know, this is the coolest place to work. And, and because that demography of that skillset, the talent in that specific category for him, people who are good at motion graphics, good at that software, all youngsters, they are all youngsters.

[00:10:47] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Just like Instagram becomes important for me because every cool company is out there, showcasing their behind the scenes of how cool it is to work here, hang around do this, do that. I want to Instagram. So that was a very interesting use case. And I see more and more, like I said, the companies have to put a human face.

[00:11:06] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: It's not like a brand logo anymore. You have to show who you really are. And I think Instagram is one of the most interesting platforms to show that humane aspect of your business and your company, that we are not just a logo. We are people behind that logo. And this is real people doing real stuff. 

[00:11:26] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: I think Instagram is a fantastic platform for building that kind of trust

[00:11:29] Surbhi Dedhia: When you say that it is a really interesting platform to build the trust, does it mean that you

[00:11:38] Surbhi Dedhia: are pointing towards the way the platform is structure? 

[00:11:42] Surbhi Dedhia: Like, you know, more imagery like video, or like someone said a picture says a thousand words, whereas a video can say like a million words at a time. So you know, is, does it, does it mean that, or is it something? 

[00:11:57] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah, so Instagram is geared the way the platform is designed. It's a visual platform. Definitely. It's designed for engagement. It's like you have Instagram stories, which give you so many ways to instantly create engagement, right? So you have polls, stickers, you have so many it's like designed for that.

[00:12:19] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You can go instantly, go live on on which platform allows you to go instantly. Right. for hours, right. And have that crowd communicating and interacting with you right in live-time, comments will start happening. So engagement wise, it's the platform to be. You can get the highest rate of engagement there, if you do it right.

[00:12:41] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You ask a question, put a poll, all such a things are possible and so easy. Like you just have to touch the button and the poll is answered, right? So there are a lot of features which are, which Instagram has allowed for that engagement and that connection instant DM like you post a story and somebody can just direct message you, right?

[00:13:03] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So you, you are connecting with the person or whoever you want, you know, your target audience in such a personalized way instantly. So depending on how you.

[00:13:18] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah, and I was 

[00:13:18] Surbhi Dedhia: just going to come to that. You just said that depending on how you use it. So while I have you the expert today with us, tell us how, how do we get it all right. Like I mean, for somebody who's like me, I'm there, but I'm not really there. So how do I maximize it? 

[00:13:35] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah. So one of the pain points that I hear about, you know, leveraging social and leveraging Instagram or any platform is the overwhelming.

[00:13:45] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: There's so much to do so much content. I post everyday stories as everyday business. Like I'm running a business here. I'm not sitting on social media all the time. Right. That's one of the biggest concerns of business owners that I have a business to run. So to that, my answer is that. If there is a proper framework and the proper system to manage the platform, you can very well run your business.

[00:14:10] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You're going have to be twenty four, seven glued to your phones or mobiles, and you don't have to be constantly checking how many people like my post or commented on. That's not what we are talking about here. When we talk about a sustainable solid framework that can help your business to really take advantage of a platform and build solid strategies around it.

[00:14:30] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So I, I took a deep dive in some of the most successful Instagrammers out there. And I wanted to understand what is it that they do and how can businesses emulate that? And after a very deep study I cracked the code to be honest. I I'm like you look at the best out there. They followed this what I now call, I put my own spin on it.

[00:14:52] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And I call the six C's to success framework on Instagram. They're really 6 Cs and they have to be happening in that order for you to succeed.

[00:15:07] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah. So, so, and you, because you're a business owner yourself, you talk about buyer personas. In fact, the last conversation you and I had was around buyer personas. So here is the six Cs to success framework on Instagram to do it well, methodically and without the overwhelm or anxiety that surrounds a lot of myth-busting I can do about Instagram.

[00:15:31] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: The first C is all about clarity. You got to be crystal crystal clear about. Why is it that you want to be on the platform? What's your why? Ultimately you have to answer that deep. Why what's, what is it that drives you? What do you bring to the table to the world? How do you want to make a difference to this world?

[00:15:51] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: What have you got to offer, right. And whom to whom do you want to offer that. Who is it that you want to serve? 

[00:15:58] Surbhi Dedhia: Like the example you gave earlier, about the business owner, who was in motion, graphic. He was so clear that he wants to attract the millennials. And you know, that is, that is a reason why he's on instagram. 

[00:16:11] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: He was very clear. This is my objective. This is my target audience. This is what I want. This is my why. I want to be very clear on my why, because what happens is that initially when we go on the platform and we are very, we have all the fire in the belly, we want to be very enthu about it.

[00:16:27] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And then the, you know, the enthusiasm wanes after some time and you don't see the result, right? Like, ah, this is not giving me. It's not worth my time and money and you lose it because there was no consistent that why was lost somewhere. You just tried it, tested it and it does not work. Right? So, so once you have that why sorted, even in the low of times, when, when you're not seeing the result, when you're not seeing the exact thing that you would want that platform to do for you, you will hang in there.

[00:16:59] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You will stay there. And that's when the platform rewards you. It's not that instant thing that you put six posts out there, and then you, you know, post and ghost that will not work. So first C is clarity. So that is the number one thing. Be very clear. So clear that you should be able to say in one line, this is what I do.

[00:17:18] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: This is who I serve. This is how I solve your problem. And after your problem is solved, this is what you will feed your business. How I will change your world. Right? I'll take you from point a to point B. Once you have that clarity, that becomes your, what we call the optimized Instagram bio. An Instagram bio gives you 160 characters.

[00:17:41] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So you've got to make sure that you have such clarity about your why, that you should be able to say, say it in those many words. And anybody who visits your profile should be able to quickly tell, oh, they are about this. This is how they help. And this is why I need to follow them or not. So that clarity is super important.

[00:18:02] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: The second C is content, right? So once, once you have the clarity, you will then use content as a mechanism to connect with your audience. Content is the mechanism that tells us, this is what we're about. This is how we can help it. So again, from the clarity, will flow the content.

[00:18:19] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. Right. So to speak on the on the channel. 

[00:18:24] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Absolutely. So the two are so inextricable linked that only when you have clarity about who you are, what you do, what's your target audiences. Then only the content will flow out of that. Right? And so the second C's all about content. And again, I see the biggest pain point around content is, oh my God, how would I come up with content ideas?

[00:18:44] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Like you have to post every day here, how many things to talk about. So I tell you in this course, I give you such wonderful hacks that you will never tell me this, that I can't think of content ideas. You only need to listen. There are such powerful tools and technologies ready to tell you what your customers want to hear from you about.

[00:19:08] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: They are talking. The question is, are you listening? So there are tools, and technology. I mean, even free to like give you a very quick hack. You just go to Google suggest and type one keyword related to your business or whatever it is that you do. Google itself, will throw you 10 suggestions right there.

[00:19:25] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Isn't it. That's what people are asking. People are asking so many things about your business. It is your business to answer their questions and be in there, you know top of the mind, recall and answer those questions directly. Be relevant. Well, that's it. That's all, its content is all about being relevant to your audience, saying things that will resonate with them saying things that will fulfill their needs.

[00:19:48] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah so second is content. And I share like tons of tips in this course on how you can come up with content, which will resonate with your audience. There's no way that your content comes from the right place and right research why it won't resonate with your audience. And once you have clarity on who you are going after. That is the second C.

[00:20:12] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: The third C is what I call consistency. So you got to show up for your tribe, you got to show up for your tribe. You know, you can set the frequency. I'm not saying you do it every day, whatever frequency is suitable for your business, your resources that you have established that consistency. If you say I'm going to go live, or I'm going to go post on this platform every three days, or I think the, the life of a post on Instagram is up to 72 hours and then it starts dying.

[00:20:45] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Right. So to make sure that. Yeah, fulfill that frequency, make sure that you come up with content and be consistent. And that's where that's been again, connecting back to your why like Simon Sinek, have you heard of similar to that? Find your way, find your, why people don't buy your watch. They buy in to you Why. Correct.

[00:21:06] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: When your why is close to your heart every day, you will have reason to go and show yourself or show up for your tribe. That is the next, you know, and I, again, create systems when I teach in this course. It's not that you have to think of, oh, I'm scratching my head today. Now, what do I post today? I post every day.

[00:21:26] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: No, you can do it in a very systematic way. There are systems that you can put in place. There is automation that you can put. The batch process that you've been put in place. You don't have to, you know, be thinking or scratching on the spot. It can be very well-planned. You can use automation, you can use technology, which makes life easier. So to bust that myth that you don't have to be 24 7 on these platforms, constantly showing up regularly in a consistent way.

[00:21:55] Surbhi Dedhia: Right. Anjuli, can I ask you here? What is the good frequency? You said 72 hours, which means every three days you've got to post. Is that what you're saying? And for B2B brands is. And then, sorry, I should, I should not say B2B here. I should say for very typical very business oriented. 

[00:22:16] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So frequency I wouldn't prescribe per se 72 hours or this many days or whatever, because the best way to figure out these things is to test on the platform.

[00:22:27] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Okay. Okay. You start posting the insight and these Instagram insights itself will tell you what's working. What's not working. So the best way to figure out things is to go see for yourself, test it out. What's working a 72, as I say, because that's typically the shelf life of a content piece. And that's on, I'm talking about feed, right?

[00:22:50] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And I'm talking, if you are talking Instagram stories, which lasts for 24 hours, right? So then you establish that frequency based on, like I said, many factors, right? What's working what your insights are telling you, what your audience is telling you and what resources you have in place, because you commit to it.

[00:23:08] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You know, you got to commit to it. And if you're saying that Instagram as a platform is important to me and to my business, Then you got to commit to it with a discipline that is required to be consistent for that. You need to take stock of what resource you have available. Right? Because people will, people will start commenting and you leave them on uncertain.

[00:23:31] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: What's the point. You don't have the resource to be there to attend to it. Then it's a wasted, you know opportunity. Correct. So you got to make sure that you have the right resource, then you plan or how consistently you want to be, whether it's once a week, whether it's twice a week, once in three days, it's, I'm totally not prescribing anything as such.

[00:23:58] Surbhi Dedhia: So we said clarity content and consistency 

[00:24:02] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So the next piece is. Instagram and all of these social media channels, they are called social for a reason, right? Because you're supposed to socialize there. It's not about, you know, you tom-toming about you all the time and say, buy from me, sell from, you know, it's not about just buying and selling all the time.

[00:24:23] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Although every business owner's dream is to see those conversions happening down the line, but that's not what social media platforms are meant for. Their our main objective is for socializing, for interacting part, for creating conversations around shared interests, right? So you will have to figure out a way of how your brand or your business can fit into those engaging conversations, how you can socialize, how can you build connections and relationships.

[00:24:51] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And that is the next C, which I call community. Right. Absolutely no business can think of being successful without building the community around that business of people who are invested in your business, in your company, in, in what you do, what you bring to the table and how are they being served by it.

[00:25:12] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Right. There has to be a crowd which is being served by what you bring to the table. So community building is the next big C and Instagram allows you to do that. You know, you can find what your competitors are doing. You can find who their followers are. So you know that this, this is the same group of people who might also be interested in what I am bringing into this world.

[00:25:34] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Right. But my business has meaning. So I just have a way to influence them and show them the type. We also do this. Right. So do check us out. It's like a massive networking conference available to you when you're not to people within your competitors as well. Right? So you say, hello, we also do this, come and check us out.

[00:25:57] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Instagram gives you that opportunity to find your tribe. 1 billion people on that platform. And with systematic way of going out there and engaging through these kinds of mechanisms, like you have commenting, you can go to hashtag channels.

[00:26:15] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: You can go through, explore channel on Instagram and find your tribe through that and start engaging, start engaging with some of the biggest influencers in your competitors. So, so one of the hacks that I tell my folks about building community is just go find the top influencers in your business niche. And who is their following? What are they talking about? And starting, engaging in those conversations. Somebody's going to notice, the thing about the social media building tribe is about first. You got to give, and then you can ask, right? It's as simple as that. And that holds true for any platform, whether it is LinkedIn or whether it is any other social media channel, you got to be in a giving mindset.

[00:27:00] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: What, how can I add value? Right. Even that I see a lot of people just double tapping and liking on Instagram. You have done nothing. Believe me. That's not how you add value. So if you're like somebody's post, how are you going to add value? Add to the conversation, leave a comment, which is meaningful, not just some emoji's and some fire sign .

[00:27:20] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: That's not how you are really adding value and the person who, you know, you leave a meaningful comment for them because their posts sort of made you stop and look at their content. Somebody has produced that content with a lot of effort, right? All you need to do is give it that little bit of time and attention.

[00:27:39] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Appreciate that content leave a meaningful comment. That's how they will start noticing you their notification that somebody is engaged meaningfully with my content added to the community. They've added to the knowledge pool of the community. By adding, value there. You start doing that, the community will pay you back.

[00:28:01] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah, it will start coming back to you. And I've seen that instantly. Like I've seen it works. It just works. You do that on any platform. It's a platform agnostic. The rules are the same. 

[00:28:13] Surbhi Dedhia: I agree to that even I've experienced the same you give and you engage. And obviously there is like a world of its own.

[00:28:22] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. And of course, I'll go to them. The magical algorithm. That is omnipresent.. 

[00:28:26] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah. So how does the, algorithm figure out that these are your friends and people you are interested in because you are engaging with the content. That's the only signal the algorithm is also picking that, Hey, there is some conversation, there's some engagement happening.

[00:28:41] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So from the community, you built your community, the next C, which C are we on now, 

[00:28:48] Surbhi Dedhia: Clarity, content, consistency, and community 

[00:28:54] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Then comes, you know, you build connections because you are not just, please don't copy paste comments, please don't do hacky stuff like that.

[00:29:02] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Where, you do one mass commenting or you, do one, bot kind of a stuff that is going to ban you. That's not what social media, social media, genuine engagement, genuine comment, genuine conversations. So if you do that, You will definitely build a community. And we will attract like-minded people who are interested in talking about you, your business and anything around your business, right?

[00:29:26] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So you are engaging with the right automatically attracting the right tribe to your business. The next piece then is to take that relationship deeper. Start conversations. So now, now you're getting ready for the warm up. From the cold people who din't know about you till date are aware about you they're part of your community now, what is community?

[00:29:51] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: It's nothing but a whole giant pool of warm leads, potential customers. who are, listening to you are waiting to be converted. It is this potential prospect that you can start building deeper relationships with and build connections. Absolutely. Right. So you start deepening your relationship for the conversation.

[00:30:15] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: They say in Instagram community it all goes down in the DMs, right? Ultimately it's in the DM that you're having that real conversation with that real person. It's one of the most friction free most friction, less ways to connect with your clients through Instagram messaging channel.

[00:30:34] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: It allows you to different ways you can do video call. You can send somebody, an audio message. You can type a message. It's so many ways to connect right on Instagram message. Sometimes it takes a long time to type them. I said don't, don't talk, just speak it. Yeah. It's so much more authentic when you leave a note or right.

[00:30:55] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And or you just do a quick video and send somebody a video message right there, and you've done your first sales prospecting or sales warm-up call. What you need to do is then you, you first understand ask them, what are they about. Show interest in them, like, there's a very interesting quote that I get inspired by, which says, if you're not interested, you're not interesting. So for you to be interesting to other people you have to be first interested in them.

[00:31:28] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Got it. Yeah. So you show your interest in others, find out about that and that's see, that's how you qualify a lead. That's how you figure out whether or not this is the right prospect for you to be taking the conversation further. Otherwise, you leave the conversation. You don't have to use every opportunity to sell.

[00:31:45] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Lead the conversation and add some value in some way to their life. And they will have nothing but good will to take away. Right. Even if you didn't make a sale, that's fine. They might refer you to somebody who might be the right prospect for your right customer, correct conversation. 

[00:32:03] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Finally, when we talk about conversion for that your mechanics and your, your funnel, your whole system has to be well set. Your CRM has to be in place. If you're talking B2B, how are you taking your Instagram messaging and you're prospecting into your sales pipeline, then what are you doing for the whole followup system?

[00:32:25] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Do you have a system in place? And today Instagram now is allowing automation for even with bots. So you can use automation tools to segment. You can use automation tools to have a FAQ is know the most frequently asked questions. You can do customer surveys. You can do so much with Instagram automation and, and fantastic work around automation that is possible to do Instagram has very well recently opened its API for starting these automated conversations.

[00:32:59] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So that's it. You could just tie it up with your CRM and there you are. You have a proper person you know, proper CRM channel connected to a very powerful platform. So you, you take it to the next level through that. Those are my six Cs that's how that's the system.. 

[00:33:19] Surbhi Dedhia: Yes, I think I like the flow of it. And also I liked that how it is all tied into a marketing 1 0 1 here because it is really that step-by-step process, a systematic approach that can help you.

[00:33:32] Surbhi Dedhia: You know, it's like a foundation that you set it up first and then it can help you go forward in your journey as a business. From the perspective of Instagram, you said there are a lot of options now, how does one not get overwhelmed with all these options? So like, from my perspective, I'm thinking, should I use a story or IGTV, should I you know, put a video post or like those carousal kind of slider posts or just a post.

[00:33:58] Surbhi Dedhia: So what do you have to say on that? 

[00:34:01] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Very good question. And it's something I can probably relate to that there are so many different content formats. There's so much that you can do. So what do you prioritize on? There are a couple of factors here. One is what is your strength and what will project, you know, your organization in the best possible way, your business in the best possible way.

[00:34:22] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: There are some people who are camera shy, but they can create great content. Right? So, so you may not, I know a lot of business owners who don't want to be the face of the business, right. They would rather not come on camera and I know a lot of people, so for them, maybe, you know, you can create animated educational content you can experiment with carousels.

[00:34:48] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Because it has these different varieties of content formats available, you don't have to stick to one. Have a experimental approach and to see again, which, and every time you post to different kinds of content, it will resonate differently with the different kinds of audiences, because you see even the audiences have their preferences.

[00:35:09] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Some audiences prefer video, right? More consume more of your carousel kind of content, which is like a, I want to just learn I'm here to educate myself today. So we, you have to understand that different people, your audience is going to be motivated by different you know, reasons why they are consuming your content.

[00:35:29] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: It could be either they want to be inspired today. They could be wanting to be entertained today, or they could be wanting to educate themselves today. We mostly consume content for these three reasons. Right. So entertain me, educate me, inspire that's it. Right, right, right. There's more, the reason why anybody would scroll up, consume content.

[00:35:48] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So you have to try and be all of these things to all of these people in different, different pockets, right. Because you don't know where your target customer might be you know, sitting and in what mode is he or how are you meeting his needs that day? That in that moment in time. So you've got to try and experiment with different stuff and then your insights is the best place to go to guide your future efforts. And that then becomes your baseline. 

[00:36:17] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So in terms of allocating your resources, you decide,basis what your insights are telling you. If your insights are telling you that carousel is performing best for us, let's place, greater energies behind carousels. But at the same time, 20% of our energy should also be spent experimenting and testing different formats.

[00:36:37] Surbhi Dedhia: Right. And when you say insights, do both business and personal account, give you that insight?

[00:36:43] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So personal account will not give you the insight. If you want proper Instagram insights, you need to have a business account. 

[00:36:50] Surbhi Dedhia: And it is not a paid account, right? Like in business account, it's like a free for all

[00:36:57] Surbhi Dedhia: right. So I also see something called us highlights. How can businesses leverage that? Like, is it something like a showcase page? Like what LinkedIn has?

[00:37:08] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Infact I made a post about Instagram, where I provocative you know, caption. I said, websites are dead. Okay. I really believe that because today, if anybody wants to check out a company, the first place they go to is the social media channels.

[00:37:27] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Right. With Instagram, your highlights can actually take the place of what you would have otherwise put on your website, the different menus about us, home, our work all of that, right? Yes. All of those pieces that you would have otherwise put on your website, or you do it traditionally put on your website, talk about your company, your work about you, all the FAQ, all of that. can come on your Instagram highlights because highlights stay there. Stay longer than 24 hours. So one of the highlights. Forever. Okay. They are like, just like posts. They just stay there. They're just like, yeah. And you can keep adding some of the companies they really make very effective use of highlights around.

[00:38:14] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: If you are a company into, drop shipping, people will have ton of questions around, you know, shipment that there isn't that. And,freigh t rates, you can just have an entire highlight section dedicated to these FAQ's right. Or, or if you have you know, returns, or customer service questions. So there are a lot of these things that you can cover through highlights or you want to showcase your work, right? So there could be a highlight dedicated to that. Our work, our portfolio, like this is who we help all. You could dedicate another section for testimonials, like what others have said about us.

[00:38:52] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: That's a credibility building you could just dedicate their entire highlight for just that. There are some very good use cases for using highlights. And in fact, people, how they do is they, they start with the first highlight will be start here. This is where you start. This is how we want you to navigate, you know?

[00:39:11] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And, and, and there's another one which you can completely dedicate to behind the scenes where you want to show up, you know, you're behind the scenes of the company and how you work, what is your work culture, all of that. Right? Right. Yeah. So that's where it highlights. Very, very powerful. 

[00:39:30] Surbhi Dedhia: Sure. So at the beginning of this conversation, you were saying how LinkedIn, IBM, Zendesk are some of the top names in the business world, that do a brilliant job on Instagram. Are there any like within these companies, are there anything that stand out for you that they do very well? 

[00:39:49] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah. So I've been checking out some of these business accounts and trying to learn from, what is it that they're doing? So what I noticed about Zendesk is that they're using a lot of video. They use a lot of reels to show fun side of their business. But every business can have a personality. Today you don't have to be a boring brand. So they have these very cool, funny videos around customer service. Zen desk is all about. It's a really cool video of somebody who wants to take inspiration should check out. They have these cool videos about, you know, customer service and customer calling some funny stories, very well tied in. You can imagine what a fun place Zendesk might be, I mean, that's the impression that you get, wow, very modern company, very fun to be working with one to, you know, work with. The other company that I saw, like what stood out for me for Salesforce in fact is using Instagram very well. What Salesforce is using very effectively is they're presenting a lot of their customer success stories. So they are using a lot of their customers and sort of putting them in that spotlight. So they're taking the spotlight away from them and putting it on their customers and sharing their successes. Right. And how very subtle way of showing that how, Salesforce, might have worked behind the scenes.

[00:41:15] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: It is these heroes who have achieved their goals and we just work behind the scenes to make it happen. Right. So that's a nice way of positioning. Absolutely. Yeah, they're the heroes. They take all the limelight and we are just people behind, you know, enabling things for. So that's, that's something that's stood out for me from a Salesforce angle. MailChimp.

[00:41:39] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: What I noticed very interesting about them is, is they're using a different kind of formats. And they also showcase like one of the main aspects of all these product companies are software as a service company is to educate the prospect or the potential user, about how to use the various features of their products or companies.

[00:42:02] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And so they have these very cute mini tutorial. Which tell you, you know, one little piece, like, for example, I just saw a post today where MailChimp is showing how you can use their creative studio to create posts for your business and directly post on social media. 

[00:42:20] Surbhi Dedhia: So amazing. Anjuli so far, you're telling us so many interesting examples of companies and these are very large companies established companies. And I know that you work with a new empower, a lot more smaller businesses as well. So tell us about your work with smaller businesses and how they have leveraged Instagram in specific. 

[00:42:44] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So in the smaller business space, I mostly worked with B2C and I have seen the power of the platform. So if, if that's interesting, I can talk about that. Yeah. Like, yeah, like I help this traditional brick and mortar store, they were into, selling clothes stores, physical stores, and become Covid everybody needed to pivot to digital. And they have used Instagram so effectively. In fact, they have gone doing live sales. They've gone live, doing Instagram lives, selling their stock, showcasing their product. And they're like so many people who book their stuff right there in the live sale. So, and live streaming and live you know, selling on Instagram of these kinds of products is it's huge. It works big time and you can go for hours, there's no time limit. As long as the public is engaging. As long as they're showing interest an engaging with your content, you can keep, you know interacting and engaging.

[00:43:48] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So that's one great example that I've seen with Instagram stories being very used very effectively. Instagram live being used very effectively 

[00:43:58] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: right. I've seen that work very powerfully for some of the brands that I enable and I help with. 

[00:44:06] Surbhi Dedhia: I'm just thinking out loud here. And what about those companies? You know, who are into manufacturing? Like, I'm just thinking of one of, one of the clients that I have, and they're not on Instagram, as yet. Probably they should be now that you've given us so many ideas, but I'm thinking about this company, which is into manufacturing of industrial Springs. Yeah. 

[00:44:28] Surbhi Dedhia: And what can they do? Because they don't have like this you know, industrial Springs is a cut and dry. They, they interact with a lot of manufacturers, actually, some of their Springs go in big railway projects or you know, making rails, right?

[00:44:43] Surbhi Dedhia: Like the, the Springs needed, or even in automotive industries, even in manufacturing industries. So how can they, showcase 

[00:44:52] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: great question. Absolutely. A great question. Again, manufacturing industry, somebody will see I'm a manufacturer, I'm like an old world manufacturer. What have I got to do with Instagram?

[00:45:03] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And I say got a lot, you've got a lot that you can use this platform for. I work in the fashion space, so I worked with a lot of these manufacturers who are typical B2B companies that somebody is supplying textile dyes. Somebody is just in the processing part of the, you know apparel manufacturing.

[00:45:24] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Somebody is just a button supplier. And so many of them are using the Instagram effectively. It's it's still early stages. They, people have not really discovered and how, or how effectively you can use it, but the ones who know how to use it, they're doing it well. So they're telling their sustainability stories, they're telling their you know, their value system, what they stand for, they're telling how they treat their people.

[00:45:49] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Now, even the sustainable development goals surround themselves, or concern themselves around how you treat your people. All of those stories can come alive on a visual platform like Instagram, very, very beautifully, very authentically, in a very unfiltered way 

[00:46:07] Surbhi Dedhia: sure. Also, that brings me to think of individuals. Like we spoke about organizations big and small, and you gave brilliant examples of how they can leverage this platform of Instagram. On the show, we talk about building thought leadership on individuals, as well as organization. And I think at this point it would be interesting to know from you, how can individuals not, I'm not talking really about those influencer kind of individuals who kind of know how to use and flex the platform to their advantage, but really people who are building thought-leadership genuinely people who are interested in raising the bar on digital landscape to build that community, build that connections. How can they leverage instagram?

[00:46:55] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: The rules apply the six CS of success on Instagram. It applies to an individual as much as it applies to an organisation. That individual who wants to build the thought leadership person wants to build their thought leadership has to know what's my, why, what is it that I bring to the table to this world?

[00:47:12] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: How can I make a difference to, you know, the people I want to make a difference to who am I going after? So once you have that clarity, you will go out there and do it consistently because once it is your why you, you live for that, you, you breathe for that. That's what you, you know, that's what I call the Ikigai the concept of Ikigai?

[00:47:32] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Once you figured out that this is what gives you that spring in your step, that's why you wake up every morning. That's your reason for living. Then you show up. I'm not sure consistently with, with authenticity and, and again, the six CS apply so the same rules, the same, the same structure, the same framework, the same six Cs, will apply to an individual as beautifully as it does to an organisation.

[00:47:58] Surbhi Dedhia: Absolutely. And I feel as, as much as I'm seeing through my work, working with these executives and business owners I feel like that whole belongingness that comes together with creating this space for your own self and sharing, it's so much more. You collected these entrepreneurs, the initial phase, and you began teaching them what you had known and learned, gave you that fuel to propel you into creating all this together and passing it on as much as possible for other people. And I've seen the same thing with thought leaders that I've worked with. I see that impact that they create with you know, these different social media channels. And now I think I want to ask you more about your influence mastery course. 

[00:48:43] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yeah. So especially for your folks and people who are listening to this show, it's, it's my humble offering, I did a lot of effort in putting this together. And I said, I built it with people like you. my learners, were my teachers. And that's how I built this program with a lot of genuine intention. And so you can go on this website called courses dot Anjuli g.com.

[00:49:07] Surbhi Dedhia: I will put it in the show notes as well. 

[00:49:09] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Yes. And there are two parts of this one is a free course because I want you to check me out. I want you to see my style of teaching and, you know, whether you feel genuinely connected with me or not take a call and then there's a paid version.

[00:49:22] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And even the paid version of this course, which has like lot of in-depth knowledge about really how you can use the platform I go into very tiniest of details. Like there's a whole section dedicated to just building your hashtag strategy and doing your hashtag research. For example, there's a whole section dedicated to how you can find, how can you use Instagram as a tool for research and find your audience through the various tools that are available within the platform itself?

[00:49:52] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So there there's a lot of wealth to be found there, a lot of value adding information that you can use for your business. I would encourage you to take a look and for your audience. I have kept it at a specially low price of only 19.95. 

[00:50:09] Surbhi Dedhia: Wow. Okay. That's a steal. That's definitely a steal 

[00:50:13] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: And once you buy this course, you have lifetime access to it. And if you don't like it, I offer a money back guarantee. I'm so confident that this will add value to your life. Then I'm willing to offer a money back. Like if you don't like it. So you've got nothing to lose. 

[00:50:32] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: So yes, that this is, this is so fantastic.

[00:50:34] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: I think nobody ever else has ever done this on the show to offer something of such a high value at a heavily discounted rate, as well as giving a trailer, which is a free part of it. So thank you Anjuli I really appreciate this and to our audience. It's again, my humble request to go check it out.

[00:50:52] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: I'll put the links to both the courses in the show notes below and 

[00:51:00] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: follow me on Instagram. 

[00:51:02] Surbhi Dedhia: Oh yes. Yes, exactly. That was my next question. Where do people find you? Is it AnjuliG? 

[00:51:13] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Its @anjuligo. You can find me there on Instagram. I share lots of useful tips, even if you don't want to enroll for my free course, you can still follow me and find lots and lots of useful information. That's what I do. That's my Ikigai learn and to shed light on it. 

[00:51:32] Surbhi Dedhia: Awesome. Awesome. That is so amazing. And to be in those once again, such a pleasure to learn from you again on Instagram and also to share these ideas that you spoke about. Thank you. 

[00:51:47] Anjuli Gopalakrishna: Thank you. I hope I was able to add value thank you so much. It's been an honor.