The World of Podcasting with Evo Terra

[00:00:00] Surbhi Dedhia: Hello, Evo. And welcome to the Making of a Thought Leader podcast. It is so amazing to have you here today with us.

[00:00:08] Evo Terra: Thank you very much for inviting me. It's a, it's a pleasure to be here. 

[00:00:13] Surbhi Dedhia: Wonderful. I have known you already, because I have heard so many of podcast pontification, episodes that, uh, I, I know you, but I want audience to know you too. So, can you please introduce yourself? 

[00:00:28] Surbhi Dedhia: I will, I will do my level best. So hi, my name is Evo Tara. I am a podcaster and have been a podcast for a very. Long time. Since the, since the early days of podcasting, I was the 40th podcaster ever, which is a crazy thing to say. Um, I've written podcasting for dummies.

[00:00:47] Surbhi Dedhia: I've had lots of businesses in the podcasting space and these days I do a lot of different podcasts, but I run a production company called simpler media productions. We make podcasts for businesses and I have a daily short form podcast, which is called podcast pontifications. Which is designed for the serious podcasters or who want to understand the present and future of podcasting.

[00:01:08] Surbhi Dedhia: Wow. Okay. Let me, let me just unpack this a little bit here, because you said so many big milestones. So 40th podcast, you know, I I've read about it. Heard you speak so many times, but it's, I still can't get my head around it. How do you, and you were still podcasting, right? Like you're still continuing, the daily episodes on podcast pontifications?

[00:01:32] Evo Terra: Well, podcasts pontifications has only been going on since 2018, but I got my start in podcasting back in 2004. But but that is correct. 

[00:01:40] Surbhi Dedhia: Wow. So, you have been podcasting constantly since 2004 am I right to say that? 

[00:01:47] Evo Terra: Uh, well defined constantly. I mean, that's the great thing about podcasting is that, you know, it means a lot of different things.

[00:01:54] Evo Terra: So, I have been actively podcasting or supporting podcasters really that entire time. Uh, I haven't always been behind the microphone every single day. Like I am right now. I, I talked to several different hiatuses, uh, and, and change. So, I was adding them up the other day. And I think the number right now is 26.

[00:02:14] Evo Terra: And it means 26 different podcasts that I have either been the host or the co-host of, since I began my career in podcasting back in 2004, which is an insane number, but it gets even worse when you figure it out. I think I have helped about a little over a thousand people make a podcast, whether that is the clients that I have right now, or the consulting clients I've had previously or through the work I did with a service called Podio books.com, where we were encouraging, uh, under published authors to make podcast version, audio books, uh, of their books and put them out there.

[00:02:48] Evo Terra: And we had over 700 titles we helped distribute. So yeah, me and podcasting, we go way back. 

[00:02:55] Surbhi Dedhia: You have a long-standing relationship with it. I can see. So Podio w what did you say your cost? Is that what you said? 

[00:03:02] Evo Terra: Podio books. Podiobooks.com books. 

[00:03:04] Surbhi Dedhia: Okay. Is it still going on, like for anybody who wants. 

[00:03:08] Evo Terra: It, it is, it is not, but it was, it was a fun experiment.

[00:03:11] Evo Terra: I started it in 2005. This was before, uh, back in 2005, audio books were expensive. They were very difficult to get. You either bought them from audible or you bought a whole bunch of CDs, but there wasn't really, we didn't really, we didn't have mobile phones that were capable of pushing content down like we do today.

[00:03:30] Evo Terra: So, in 2005, if you were at, and also at the time, um, Amazon sold physical books, they didn't really sell that many eBooks. There was no such thing as a Kindle eBooks. Weren't a thing. And so, in 2005, when we started podiobooks.com, the whole reason for it was since authors have a tough time getting published, we could let them self-publish. Well, it wants a couple of years before the Kindle came out and eBooks became a regular thing and audio books really exploded. So, we closed the service in 2015. I actually sold it to another company and rolled it into a service called scribble, which helps people, independent authors promote their products around.

[00:04:09] Evo Terra: Yeah, so it was a lot of fun. We had 700 titles, I think was our max pushing around two or 3 million downloads per month of content. So, lots of people and all of those books are still available. You can still search Podio books in most of your podcast apps, and you'll find a whole bunch of content to listen to. 

[00:04:26] Surbhi Dedhia: Wow.

[00:04:27] Surbhi Dedhia: That is so interesting that that kind of completely opens up a new avenue to talk about. But I want to bring back to, and ask you this, how companies actually, can build thought leadership through podcasts.

[00:04:43] Evo Terra: It's not an easy proposition. There's no magic button that comes with developing thought leaderships in podcasting. Um, first off you have to be a thought leader. You have to have someone in your organization who is a thought leader who is generating content, who is constantly being on the forefront of, of what it is that you do.

[00:05:02] Evo Terra: And if you have someone in your organization or perhaps a series of someone’s in your organization, then podcasting opens up an opportunity to give voice to their voice. It's a nice way to publish content. It's a growing way to publish. So, what they podcast much like you could have done with a blog previously or much like people are trying to do. And in social media, you can now give voice to the people who are thought leaders in your company and build a podcast around.

[00:05:29] Surbhi Dedhia: Absolutely. Um, audience listening to the show is usually entrepreneurs and business owners who want to, boost their, digital visibility. And I think one of the avenues that feels more comfortable is podcast. In fact, I help, companies, SMEs and midsize businesses to think about podcast as one of the key elements to add to the marketing mix.

[00:05:57] Surbhi Dedhia: And very often than not, it is who will speak in the mic, who will, who will be the voice. And that brings me to think about. The impact voice can have, like the identity a voice can create and you have been in podcasting for so long. So, I wanted you to tell something more about what you have experienced in creating that identity through voice.

[00:06:24] Evo Terra: It's really important. I mean, the, the voice that you speak with. Is on a podcast and a blog on an article you're writing on voices is very important. I used to run digital advertising agencies and we worked quite a lot on tone and style and voice as we were creating content for customers. So. It's even more important in podcasting then and other forms because you can actually hear it. It's not something that is this nebulous concept of voice. You literally get to listen to someone or some ones talk to you for 10 minutes, 30 minutes, an hour and a half at a time.

[00:07:05] Evo Terra: So that voice really truly comes through. And a lot of companies struggle with it because. How do you let your employees have their voice come through? And how does a blend with the company, but the right spokes people for your company? That's one concern. Or voice as a brand. Do they want to listen to your voice as a brand?

[00:07:27] Evo Terra: Do you really have something worth saying to people you may not, and you may have to work really hard to develop that and, and to let it come through. The thing I want to impress upon people is that you can't just make the decision to have a podcast and assume that's going to work. You have to really put the thought into it and build the strategy around letting that voice shine through so that your business is best represented.

[00:07:54] Surbhi Dedhia: Absolutely. I think the points that you make here are spot on in terms of. Who should be the one who should be taking the microphone, and it's not one person whose it's not his or her responsibility? It's like the entire team effort and the whole strategy behind, bringing it together, like every episode.

[00:08:11] Surbhi Dedhia: So that is, that is a really important concept. Um, I feel one of the areas that I've seen growing increasingly through podcast, uh, communities, meaning, from podcast, business owner or an organization doing a podcast is able to grow their community, the community around that brand.

[00:08:34] Surbhi Dedhia: And that is becoming so important because the digital landscape is very busy. And it's very difficult to seek attention of that target audience and moment you bring that community together. It is like the trust comes in through, and then it's, it's easier to communicate and connect with, that community.

[00:08:56] Surbhi Dedhia: So, uh, let's talk a little bit about the whole community aspect that a podcast can bring together. 

[00:09:04] Evo Terra: Yeah, community is super important in business. I mean every business owner, I think knows that, and I like to think of community in two different ways. There's the community that the way that you're describing it right now, which I tend to refer to as your audience, because they're the, it's the community where you are at the center.

[00:09:19] Evo Terra: And so, to me, that's much more of an audience and the community where I like to think of community more as where your show lives. The other shows, perhaps if you have other podcasts that you're related to. The local community that you belong to the larger community of your business. So, it can mean a lot of things, but when we're thinking about it from the audience perspective and building, building the ability for your audience members to then connect and interact with.

[00:09:44] Evo Terra: It, when it works, it works great because now you really have built this group of users who feel connected, who are sharing what you have to say, but let's be honest. Most businesses are going to have a real tough time doing that because just, it's great. If you're a big iconic brand and people wear your logo on their shirts, that's one thing.

[00:10:03] Evo Terra: But if you are just a small business or even a medium-sized business, Or perhaps it's a B-to-B business. There's less of that loyalty factor that comes into it and being a part of a tribe and connected. It's just a lot. It's a lot harder to get to get that going. Not that it's impossible. It's a, it certainly isn't, but I think it's, it's not, your podcast is going to do it for you.

[00:10:26] Evo Terra: It's your ability to give people a reason to connect and the podcast can help you give voice to that. The podcast can help those connections along, but really it comes to empowering your listeners, your audience, and somehow facilitating connections between them. So that they're carrying on the conversation when you're not in their ear.

[00:10:45] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. And also, you know, you, you make me think about this point of how podcast really allows that undivided attention because you're speaking into their ears which is like, you know, they're unlike when you're reading or, you know, you know, swiping the imagery. It is still at a distant and probably more distractive than doing a podcast.

[00:11:10] Surbhi Dedhia: So, I feel that brings it so much closer to the communities. Either type that you talked about just talked about. 

[00:11:17] Evo Terra: Yeah, no, no, you're exactly right. That's one of the interesting things about Pod casting is I see a lot of companies making a switch or pivot to video. Now let's put some videos out because video transactions are up higher.

[00:11:32] Evo Terra: Facebook continues to say, we're going to pivot the video. They've said that I don't know five or six different times, but the problem with the video is when you're watching a video, that's literally the only thing you can do. You can only watch a video right now, maybe you're riding on a bus, somewhere, sure, taking public transportation.

[00:11:47] Evo Terra: Then you can watch a video, but still your attention must be focused on the video. Nobody really watches a video and sorts a spreadsheet or even folds their clothes, right. There were all these things you cannot do. You are, you are stuck. So even if you're making an internal podcast for your employees, a lot of companies are making internal podcasting now.

[00:12:05] Evo Terra: Um, and if you say, no, we want videos instead, we'll remember the person you're asking to watch the video. That's all they're going to do for the 10 minutes or 30 minutes. But with a podcast it's a found time activity. People who can listen to it whenever they want.

[00:12:22] Evo Terra: They can listen to it while they're doing their morning chores. They can listen to it while they're on their commute to work. They can listen to it while they're making lunch in the break room. There are all types of opportunities because your brain will let you listen and listen intently while you're doing other, I guess, mindless tasks or tasks that require a lot less of your initial focus. That's one of the real unique powers of podcasting is to give people content, and allow them to enjoy it on their schedule without forcing them to carve out a block. This is my podcast. Listening time. No, you don't have to do that.

[00:12:56] Evo Terra: It's also time you're doing something else. And that's really important. 

[00:12:59] Surbhi Dedhia: Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, Evo, tell me about this, this whole thing about, you helping other companies. You said that you have helped companies and individuals launched their own podcasts. Thousands of them, can you give me some examples of how they have leveraged podcasting medium to, impact the business, uh, ROI. Like, has there been any case so far because you've been in this for so long, so that's why I thought I should ask you this example. Uh, if you could share some 

[00:13:34] Evo Terra: Yeah, and I'm, I'm glad you bring this topic up because quite often, when we look at.

[00:13:40] Evo Terra: Podcasting and someone asks a question. Why should we have a podcast? So many people rushed to the idea of, well, it's an opportunity for us to, uh, sell advertising or it's an opportunity for us to grow a really big brand because people are just dying to listen to our podcast. And I think that certainly can be the case. We see articles about podcasting showing how many times, millions of views or downloads. Someone is getting how; how large their audience is a 60 to $80 million deals as one podcast is acquired by a big podcast network. So of course, businesses get excited and say, Hey, this is our opportunity to have our own content that goes out.

[00:14:20] Evo Terra: We can be a part of this. And while that is true, what I always tell people to remember is that most podcasts get around a hundred people listening to them. that's it. That is the total size with podcasts there, isn't an algorithm that is deciding which content should be promoted to the top and which product which should not be, what should it be demoted down? Like you see in social media, we don't have those sorts of constraints. People have to go out and grab. So, when you ask the question of how can, you know, give looking for some success stories of how businesses have successfully implemented podcasts.

[00:14:55] Evo Terra: It's a different prospect. I'm just want to really to understand that because if you make a podcast and you just put it out in the world around a hundred people maybe discovered eventually, and that may not be for you, but. But it might. So, here's an example of one early on in the podcasting world, there was a podcast, one of the first podcasts to ever get monetized was able to actually charge money for people to, to sponsor the show, not advertise, but sponsor the show.

[00:15:23] Evo Terra: It had, it was a, it was a wine focused podcast. Three guys get together, talk about wine and they were selling sponsorship on this podcast pretty successfully, um, like. Way more than they should have, because they might've had, again, around 200 listeners was about the maximum size they had, but those 200 listeners or people who work at all of the wineries in the states and other places, they were all executives at that particular level.

[00:15:55] Evo Terra: So, this company was able to take a podcast and say, hey, we're going to make something specific to these executives that only they care about. It's not the wine enthusiasts. I'm sure some wine enthusiasts were there, but this is focused in, on that business. And now they're going to direct pipeline into those people and they were able to successfully sell great sponsorship packages. I've seen other companies do the same thing where they will come along and say, we already have a mailing list of 60,000 customers. We're going to build a podcast just for them. That's going to encourage them to continue build that loyalty. We talked about previously for the community.

[00:16:28] Evo Terra: We're going to just talk to them and give them what they don't get from us. Any other way, how can we communicate the value of the company we're going to find out and then talk just to those people and maybe only 10% wind up listening. Okay. 

[00:16:42] Evo Terra: That's a really, really big number and you can build that massive loyalty around those six thousand individuals who now never stop thinking about your company because you are in their ear every week or every other week. There's another company that I worked with that was producing.

[00:16:58] Evo Terra: They were trying to get into publishing. They wanted to publish pamphlets or books or something. And we decided to do as a podcast, but as a limited series podcast, we're going to do 10 episodes around this one, very specific topic around customer experience. They were experts in customer experience. It was there, it was their thing that they did.

[00:17:16] Evo Terra: And so, we built 10 episodes podcast for them, 10 different episodes that covered the process from beginning CX to advanced CX. And instead of putting it as a book, we put it as a podcast and it was hugely successful. They won series of awards for it. They got, um, on, on radio and television to talking about this new way of doing things and it was new for this world, but of course, podcasts have been doing that a lot of long time.

[00:17:42] Evo Terra: Now this idea of limited series. So, they're planning on doing a second season. Clearly, it's clearly, it's working. So, lots of ways it doesn't just have to be one person droning on and on. Or as we're doing two people having an interview, there are lots of flavors to podcasting. 

[00:17:56] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. And that, that actually brings me to this other topic.

[00:18:01] Surbhi Dedhia: What works, meaning what are some of the best practices like, should we do a continuous podcasts, like one person going on and on, should we do interview style right now. That is, that is the type, like the format of it. Then there is this other aspect of frequency, right?

[00:18:17] Surbhi Dedhia: Like, do we do an episode like a season, you know, you just do 10 episodes and that's something, a very niche concept that you're able to talk about. And that I think works really well for brands who want to communicate about a new product or, and in fact, in my experience, what I've seen is, when the companies are smaller in resources like in number of people who are able to drive marketing function. It really makes a huge impact for them to get the thinking the thought process through the podcast. And then from this medium, actually spread it into different, uh, other mediums, so yeah, going back to that question of, the insights or the best practices that you can share about. Podcast structure, the format, the frequency, what have you been seeing? 

[00:19:08] Evo Terra: So, so it's all over the map, but let's be specific. We're talking about businesses here who should do this look. Most, most businesses don't have any reason to be in someone's ears every single week.

[00:19:19] Evo Terra: They just don't know. It's just not that important that they don't have enough to say. And also, there's the problem that most businesses are focused on you know, the business most of the time. Right. And so, carving out time. Do a dedicated every week conversation may not be in everyone's best interest.

[00:19:40] Evo Terra:  So, I'm not saying that it's not, I'm not, I'm just saying that there's a chance that way. And, and a lot of people that get into business, a lot of business owners, they get the podcasting assume we need an interview show, or we need a weekly thing. And if you can pull it off, great. If you've got the right kind of content.

[00:19:54] Evo Terra: But as you're saying, there is great value in doing these shorter, self-contained serialized things, whatever those things happen to be that, that tell the story better, or that package up some meaningful, insightful information that you can convey through your podcast. That works really well. As far as that frequency goes. As to the structure, as to the structure shorter is hugely important.

[00:20:22] Evo Terra: And I think people are starting to finally realize this. It's been 17 years. We're finally realizing. The podcasting isn't necessarily radio. Podcasting is its own format. So, we now have the ability to really take conversations that we have with other people. We can now take recording equipment out into the field and have either conversations or record background noise, you know. We're really thinking about things much more like a production, the way that a production house that builds documentaries or series for Netflix or any of the other companies that are out there that sort of production is what's.

[00:21:00] Evo Terra:  We're seeing that more and more come into podcasting. Where it's not just two people with microphones talking, but instead it is crafting a story. It is starting from the beginning, putting together a blueprint of why this podcast exists, what you're trying to communicate and how the best way to do that is.

[00:21:18] Evo Terra: That's great because the production values are going up, but also it means that means cost is going up and frequency is going down because when you're talking about a full production, it's, we're talking double digit or triple digit hours. To put together a single episode. And that is weird for a lot of people to think about that.

[00:21:37] Evo Terra:  But then again, if you've ever sat through the credits of a movie or a television show, you see all those names listed. I know that movie that you watch was 90 minutes long, but look about, I don't know, 9,000 hours to put it together. You know, it was a crazy amount of time and we're starting to see that creep into podcasting.

[00:21:55] Evo Terra: So, lots of formats work out there, but if you really want to make a splash in podcasting now, remember there are now 4.5 million podcasts. People are spoiled for choice, so you need to make sure you're making a high enough production value. Of your shows that people want to listen so that it stands up well against the other content.

[00:22:18] Surbhi Dedhia: Yes. I think that's a very good insight that you've shared. Like how do people are, how do brands differentiate themselves? Through podcasting, um, and just not get on the bandwagon because everybody else is doing that. 

[00:22:37] Evo Terra: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, do you remember this also? Um, we've seen several different studies that are surveying podcast listeners, people who listen to podcasts, not people like me who make podcasts, but people who listen to.

[00:22:48] Evo Terra: The podcast and the number always are surprising, because on average people listened to about seven different podcasts, that's it? Maybe as low as five different podcasts, that's it. So, you're not competing against the 4.5 million you're competing against the five to six to seven other shows someone is currently listening to, which is a lot.

[00:23:07] Evo Terra: I mean, if they're listening to five different shows and each one of them, there's six different shows in each one of them is 30 minutes long. That's three hours a week. Someone is listening now, again, as I mentioned previously, they're are listening in their car. They're listening when they're doing the dishes or laundry or some other services, but still, that's three hours of content.

[00:23:25] Evo Terra: You're got to break into that. How are you going to do that? What, what are you really truly have a value that says it's worthy of them kicking one of their other shows out or carving out an extra 30 minutes of their day to listen to your show? Seriously. Think about that. People are not just out there waiting to listen to your podcast.

[00:23:41] Evo Terra: You have to have a reason to do it, and it needs to be competitive. 

[00:23:47] Surbhi Dedhia: I have an extended, uh, point to this. So, in order for people to still leverage the medium, because personally, I feel that I have benefited a lot from this medium. My clients have benefited. So, while we say that you're competing against those seven podcasts, this medium also gives us the opportunity to put our thoughts out there in place. It kind of brings that body of work out. And then we are, I mean, we meaning the brands and the marketing teams are able to, leverage that content into a lot more other, which otherwise for business owners or very busy people, it gets difficult to carve out time to sit and write a blog or, you know, as a conversation, it kind of flows so organically. So, while yes, the production value is going higher and you want to kind of standout but I feel as an extension is it's going to be a good way to encourage, uh, the hesitant business owners who are not putting themselves out there in the digital landscape. 

[00:24:54] Evo Terra: The great thing about casual style of podcasting and I'll call what we're doing right now. A casual style, right?

[00:25:00] Evo Terra: They're relatively straightforward to, to record. Right. And the good, who knows what sort of magical gems come out of there? What I'm finding more and more of my clients doing as they are taking their longer form interviews is we're now really condensing them. We're taking these casual conversations like we're having right now. We're then transcribing the conversations and the client then is giving them to us.

[00:25:25] Evo Terra: One of our producers then goes through the 30 minutes or hour and a half for some of them conversation, with, with two things in mind. We know the topic and we know the angle, so we know what, why this person was invited on the program. And we know the special point of view that this particular show has we're looking for.

[00:25:42] Evo Terra: And the producer goes through and is very relentless and is just grabbing out the nuggets of information and really breaking it down. Now, some people will say, that's now you're just making it produced. And it sounds like radio. You're looking for sound bites here and there, but that's not what we're doing.

[00:25:58] Evo Terra: We're taking that conversation and we're narrowing it down, just the good parts. And then we go write a script.

[00:26:02] Evo Terra: Those pieces together. And we can summarize a lot of content. So, there was a big, long gap or Evo just went on and on and on about this one thing. Yeah. You can listen for five minutes if you want. Or I, the host can now take that or the producer can then re summarize that and then let the other bits come out.

[00:26:18] Evo Terra: We're seeing a lot of success with that because we're respecting the audience's time more, uh, and people are really responding to that, but there's a downside of it. Um, the downside is it takes more time, which means it costs, it costs money because it's a real challenge. But as I tell my clients, the upside is that is, look, we don't have to do.

[00:26:35] Evo Terra: or, the other, we can make our private, we can make our public podcast, the one we're trying to attract more people into the tighter, more condensed version that that is really enjoyable. And then we can have a separate bonus feed where the unedited conversations are there. We can transcribe those. We've already have transcribed those and put those on our website.

[00:26:56] Evo Terra: As a, as a good article, perhaps, so that people can go through and read through or use it to build other information. So we can do a lot with the content and make sure that we're getting the maximum value. Uh, so trying to keep the people who are new to us, uh, engaged and excited, or I have to say 

[00:27:14] Evo Terra: absolutely, I think, um, that is really innovative way.

[00:27:17] Surbhi Dedhia: And I have heard one such podcast, the name. Kind of leaves me, but you know what you're saying? Just to summarize, the two, two people talking, on, on a particular conference, the topic, and then it's a long conversation, but there is a whole. Who comes in between and summarizes what was being said.

[00:27:38] Surbhi Dedhia: And I felt in that particular episode that I heard it was, it was on parenting. I felt that it really helped me a little bit more to understand the host because the host had a neutral accent and the guest had a very thick accent. So it really helped me to hear and understand. Uh, she was saying more clearly.

[00:28:01] Surbhi Dedhia: So, I mean, it has dual benefits. Definitely. So I mean, and I feel again, uh, because of podcasts as a medium has become so global, you are like thousands of miles away and we are connecting or so you see how interactive and interconnected, this medium is allowing us to be. And, uh, so nothing, nothing. The people who have thicker accent, slower way of saying, or everybody's unique.

[00:28:26] Surbhi Dedhia: So I feel this idea of having a host who comes in and summarizes his brilliant. 

[00:28:32] Evo Terra: Yeah, it works really well. And we're seeing a lot of podcasts we'll switch to that model or, or even some that will, the host is still the one who's doing the interview, but then there's an announcer voice that comes on and bridges those pieces together.

[00:28:45] Evo Terra: Yeah. Getting more people

[00:28:48] Evo Terra: really thinking through what does a brand new person who's never heard any episodes of my show. This is the first thing someone sent the link to them, to my MP3 file. And they're gonna listen. What are they going to get? They don't know who the company, they know nothing about us or are they going to really have a good time listening?

[00:29:04] Evo Terra: That's who I always want to keep in mind. And you don't want to only think about those people, right? There are other reasons, but look your first 10, second. Have your show is super important. You can look at your consumption stats in apple podcasts or Spotify, or the other services that show that when we see a drop-off right, if people we blow the eight way too much where we're not getting to the point, quick enough, people will forgive a lot.

[00:29:28] Evo Terra: Once they've become a fan, once they become in, you know, into it. But the way that first impression is super important. So don't blow it. 

[00:29:35] Surbhi Dedhia: Yeah. Oh, that's, that's another good nugget there. Um, you know, earlier you were talking about five to seven podcasts, I'm curious to find out, do you listen to podcasts? And if so, uh, how many.

[00:29:49] Evo Terra: You'll 

[00:29:50] Evo Terra: listen to a hundred podcasts, like 

[00:29:53] Evo Terra: hundred shows. Yeah. I over a hundred that come in and out of rotation. Yeah. Yeah. Different individuals show about, about a hundred. I'm I'm a, not a normal person. I work in the business of podcasting. This is my only job. So I have to listen to podcasts. Producing a show I'm hosting a show from Casto, uh, they're a podcast hosting company and this show is called three clips and we interview other podcasters and it's a very highly produced show.

[00:30:17] Evo Terra: I have to go through and listen intently to those shows so that I have the right kind of questions for people. I have to listen to all of the, my clients’ podcasts. Uh, uh, uh, uh, that we, that we make and we produce, and then I have my own list of shows. I've got several daily shows that I listened to. I listened to a lot of fiction podcasts.

[00:30:37] Evo Terra: Usually my day on Sunday is spent listening to fiction podcasts and I'll have four or five different, um, serialized shows going on. And. And my feet, any given time, uh, and the others I kind of dabble around through. But yeah, if you look at my subscription list, I think it's 130 is the number of shows that are in my list, which again is very unusual.

[00:30:57] Surbhi Dedhia: I thought, I mean, I'm kind of a podcast junkie, so I keep subscribing to a lot, a lot more shows and, you know, keep going back to it. Not like week on a weekly basis from your quarterly pages, because my interests also vary. So. Uh, when you said five to seven, I said, yeah. Okay. Maybe people who are like listening, but yeah, that's a good stat as well, because I'm sure if I go around do a survey here within the podcast community, or even, um, you know, for a lay person who listened to podcasts, if that should be the number actually, but I am junkie.

[00:31:30] Surbhi Dedhia: So, I'm thinking, oh, I, if I have 75 odd podcasts on my list, on my subscription, it's not a big deal. Here. You are a hundred. That's amazing. That's amazing. Do you have a favorite though do you have a favorite? Like you never missed that show on, do you have that favorite? 

[00:31:49] Evo Terra: I have a handful that, that I keep in a, in a playlist that I call Main.

[00:31:53] Evo Terra: And so, it's just the one that I, that I, that I go to all the time. There are some daily shows. Well, there there's one particular daily show that I listened to. It's from a tech meme, ride home is the name of it. It comes out every day and it's a nice little recap of the technology stories that were out for the day.

[00:32:10] Evo Terra: I like to keep up with the new tech that's happening. So, I, that that's a never miss and in pod news, there's another one there. The daily show that James Cridland puts out that talks about the podcasting world. That's how I keep up with a lot of things that are happening. Uh, and another one that's that's done that's on a regular format is called the geologic podcast.

[00:32:28] Evo Terra: Has nothing to do with the geology. It's much more about logic and skepticism with music and humor built-in. It's from a guy named George Robb. Who's really, really funny. And it's about a 45-minute, hour, long show every week. And it's rare that I ever missed an episode of that. 

[00:32:43] Surbhi Dedhia: Wow, that's so amazing. Again, curiously asking you. Uh, how do you, how do you pack that? Like, I understand that you run a media company, you run podcast production when you get the time. 

[00:32:58] Evo Terra: Well, that's the great thing about podcasting is it's found time and it's been tough.

[00:33:03] Evo Terra: I mean, for the last 20 months or so we haven't gone out a lot. Our, our commuting has dropped, my kitchen is very clean. Let's put it that way. And I, and the reason I cleaned the kitchen quite a lot, because that's when I listened to podcasts, as I'm, as I'm cleaning up from either making dinner or cleaning up for the afternoon, whatever the needs are.

[00:33:21] Evo Terra: That's when I do most of my listening. Okay. We also my wife and I like to enjoy a bike ride. So, we go on on rides quite a bit and I listened to podcasts pretty exclusively, uh, through that. And then I carve out time during the day I'll So,, I'll take a break and go walk around the block and I'll listen to 30 minutes worth of podcasts, get fit in.

[00:33:38] Surbhi Dedhia: And that's actually my way of getting the 10,000 steps built in every day, I listen to podcasts in the middle of the day. I just woke up. Uh, of the office and just to listen to a good 30 minute or a one-hour show, depending on how the schedule is for the day. That is so good.

[00:33:56] Surbhi Dedhia: What are some of the do's and the don'ts like, what are like very critical? In your mind, what are the top three things that companies, uh, thinking of getting onto podcasts should do and should not. 

[00:34:09] Evo Terra: Yeah, I think it's probably easier to talk about the, not do things, uh, than to do, or maybe they're in together. Well, we'll see how these go. So w w what, maybe they're all combined together. So, number one is number one is don't skimp on quality.

[00:34:25] Evo Terra: It is, it is very easy to record a podcast. In fact, it's too easy to record a podcast. You can literally open up any laptop and shout out it from across the room and put audio in it. It's not hard to record. It's hard to make it sound good, actually. You know what? It's not that hard to make it sound good. If you invest in the right kind of equipment, it doesn't have to be a lot, but if you're not prepared to spend a thousand or so dollars.

[00:34:52] Evo Terra: Your audio room that you're recording in sound better. You probably going to get missed by a lot of people, just because the audio quality is so great for so many shows out there. Look, we're not putting up with it anymore on television and movies. Right. We see the high production value and that's what's happening in podcasting.

[00:35:10] Evo Terra: So that's number one. Don't do do, and don't do invest in great equipment and don't, don't just skim on, uh, action. Uh, the second thing is have a plan and a point you look, you've got to have a reason for podcasting.

[00:35:24] Evo Terra: And if your reason for podcasting is just because everybody else was doing it, probably not going to be very successful. You need to lay out a plan. Um, typically I like to plan out 10 plus episodes in day. What it is, we're going to be talking about if we're going to be interviewing somebody, why are we interviewing them?

[00:35:41] Evo Terra: Um, what's the whole point of this and how does it all loop back together to what my business is? Uh, and then the last thing I would say is understand what. Business goals and objectives are and how a podcast is going to meet them. Chances are your business will not increase. As people was more people download your podcast.

[00:36:01] Evo Terra: There is probably not a one-to-one relationship between number of downloads you get and what your balance sheet looks like for your business. So make sure you know why you're podcasting and you have, you're able to trap and capture the right kind of metrics that prove it. Because if you're judging your success by how many downloads you have, you're missing the point, unless you were in the business of selling downloads, like you're a magazine or something else that's advertising supported.

[00:36:29] Evo Terra: That makes sense. But the rest of the metric of podcasting probably don't. mean a lot to your business. So find out what does, how can your podcast make your phone ring? How can your podcast get you invited to speak at conferences and events? How many people are responding to your episodes and giving you more feedback?

[00:36:48] Evo Terra: Can you track back an actual customer to find out if they're listening to your show and did they spend more money with you this year than last year? Those are the important business metrics. Don't forget. 

[00:36:56] Surbhi Dedhia: Right. Wow. That was so many great nuggets of information. Thank you so much, Evo. Is there something else you would like to.

[00:37:05] Evo Terra: Uh, it, it has been a pleasure. Thank you very much for having me on the show. Uh, if, people who are thinking about starting a podcast, is that the things that you think, you know, you may not know, this is a rapidly evolving and changing world. Make sure that the information you're getting is current and up-to-date because.

[00:37:21] Evo Terra: Wow. It's, it's changing so rapidly. I mean, in the 17 years I've been doing this, I haven't seen the, the rate of change continues to increase, and I know that's going to keep going for the future. So, but yeah, do it. It's a, it's a fun community to be a part of, if you really jump into podcasting with both feet.

[00:37:37] Surbhi Dedhia: Yes, absolutely. I I'm a testimony to that. Jumped in with two feet and it's really so brilliant. Got a chance to connect with you so many miles away and yeah. Where can people find you? 

[00:37:50] Evo Terra: Well, podcast pontifications if you are in the business of podcasting and you want to know more about podcasting check out podcast, pontifications at podcastpontifications.com.

[00:38:00] Evo Terra: If you want to connect with me socially that is I'm on Twitter as kind of my exclusive social media platform, where I'm simply at Evo Tara and every business wants to get the podcast and you need a pro in your corner, check out simpler.media

[00:38:16] Surbhi Dedhia: Awesome. I'll put all links in the show notes as well, so everybody can get it.

[00:38:21] Surbhi Dedhia: And this is such an amazing conversation. I am so thankful for you to come on the show and I'm sure the audience will also gain a lot more insight from what we spoke today. So thank you so much. 

[00:38:34] Evo Terra: Thanks for having me.